Comments on: The case against disaster relief http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/ Exploring how to get real change for your dollar. Thu, 17 May 2012 06:45:22 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.7 by: Jason K http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-99964 Sat, 23 Jan 2010 20:27:05 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-99964 I hate these kinds of analysis, while true it's so frustrating to read them. You know what I'm talking about, those contrarian, turn your world upside down ideas. Like if somebody said "recycling actually produces more trash". Anyway the fact of the matter is people are emotional creatures, they're going to donate to an event, they're not going to donate to an abstract concept like "donate to disaster prevention in Uganda so it doesn't end up like Haiti". It's just the way it is. People are simply not smart enough to do these kinds of intellectual Uturns. I hate these kinds of analysis, while true it’s so frustrating to read them. You know what I’m talking about, those contrarian, turn your world upside down ideas. Like if somebody said “recycling actually produces more trash”.

Anyway the fact of the matter is people are emotional creatures, they’re going to donate to an event, they’re not going to donate to an abstract concept like “donate to disaster prevention in Uganda so it doesn’t end up like Haiti”. It’s just the way it is. People are simply not smart enough to do these kinds of intellectual Uturns.

]]> by: Holden http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-99157 Tue, 19 Jan 2010 19:48:33 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-99157 Alanna, the report this post discusses is about disaster relief in general, not just search-and-rescue.  It specifically addresses disease outbreaks, stating "the imminent risk of large outbreaks in the aftermath ofnatural disasters is over-stated" (see page 1151). We don't at this point endorse the chapter's conclusions.  We haven't looked into this area enough to do so, and we also note (as we state in the original post) that the chapter is thinly sourced.  However, we do feel the chapter is worth noting since it comes from a generally high-quality source and seems to take an unusually critical position on the value of disaster relief.  We're very interested in your thoughts on it. Alanna, the report this post discusses is about disaster relief in general, not just search-and-rescue.  It specifically addresses disease outbreaks, stating “the imminent risk of large outbreaks in the aftermath ofnatural disasters is over-stated” (see page 1151).

We don’t at this point endorse the chapter’s conclusions.  We haven’t looked into this area enough to do so, and we also note (as we state in the original post) that the chapter is thinly sourced.  However, we do feel the chapter is worth noting since it comes from a generally high-quality source and seems to take an unusually critical position on the value of disaster relief.  We’re very interested in your thoughts on it.

]]> by: Rachel http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-98650 Sat, 16 Jan 2010 19:02:10 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-98650 I have worked in development for too long and am only grateful this discussion is being started now by reputable and respected sources referencing real analysis. While so much money is being genuinely donated by the global community, a lot of it will be wasted if not stolen. Yes corruption is rampant in emergency missions as prices skyrocket for basic supplies. In the weeks to come, as these stories begin to filter out of Haiti, it only makes people previously willing to contribute less likely to in the future impacting those organizations who are running effective missions, many of them local & grassroots who never receive enough funding. When additional funds are needed to rebuild infrastructure (as discussed above), it will be harder to find because these are not classified as emergency funds. But this discussion only opens a larger issue which is how donor funding is generally wasted on ridiculous overheads including expat salaries. Here in Kenya, the average salary for a UN director represents $340,000 USD/yr in salary and benefits. The average Kenyan earns less than $700 per year. I have worked in development for too long and am only grateful this discussion is being started now by reputable and respected sources referencing real analysis. While so much money is being genuinely donated by the global community, a lot of it will be wasted if not stolen. Yes corruption is rampant in emergency missions as prices skyrocket for basic supplies. In the weeks to come, as these stories begin to filter out of Haiti, it only makes people previously willing to contribute less likely to in the future impacting those organizations who are running effective missions, many of them local & grassroots who never receive enough funding.

When additional funds are needed to rebuild infrastructure (as discussed above), it will be harder to find because these are not classified as emergency funds.

But this discussion only opens a larger issue which is how donor funding is generally wasted on ridiculous overheads including expat salaries. Here in Kenya, the average salary for a UN director represents $340,000 USD/yr in salary and benefits. The average Kenyan earns less than $700 per year.

]]> by: Rachel http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-98575 Sat, 16 Jan 2010 08:56:53 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-98575 Interesting points, and I do agree in principle that donations for disaster preparedness are more logical than emergency aid. However, there are some disasters of a magnitude that cannot be foreseen, for example Hurricane Katrina, the 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami, or the Haitian earthquake. Dollars are needed right at that moment, and thank goodness people care enough to respond. Interesting points, and I do agree in principle that donations for disaster preparedness are more logical than emergency aid. However, there are some disasters of a magnitude that cannot be foreseen, for example Hurricane Katrina, the 2004 Indian Ocean tsunami, or the Haitian earthquake. Dollars are needed right at that moment, and thank goodness people care enough to respond.

]]> by: Alanna http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-98517 Sat, 16 Jan 2010 03:28:23 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-98517 I've noticed that people are linking to this post in the context of Haiti relief. I'd like to point out that emergency relief is for the survivors of the disaster - not for search and rescue. You're right that the need for search and rescue is over in 24-48 hours after a disaster. But people in Haiti need food, clean water, toilet facilities, and shelter right now if we're going to prevent a massive outbreak of typhoid, dengue fever, and malaria. I’ve noticed that people are linking to this post in the context of Haiti relief. I’d like to point out that emergency relief is for the survivors of the disaster - not for search and rescue. You’re right that the need for search and rescue is over in 24-48 hours after a disaster.

But people in Haiti need food, clean water, toilet facilities, and shelter right now if we’re going to prevent a massive outbreak of typhoid, dengue fever, and malaria.

]]> by: Jeff http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-39915 Fri, 14 Nov 2008 15:49:42 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-39915 Wow I never thought about it that way but that makes a lot of sense. When you think about it most companies cant use revenue efficiently enough to turn the cash around in months, and there is so much legal red tape with charities you can add on a few more weeks. Wow I never thought about it that way but that makes a lot of sense. When you think about it most companies cant use revenue efficiently enough to turn the cash around in months, and there is so much legal red tape with charities you can add on a few more weeks.

]]> by: Jean Wilson, Executive Director United Peace Relief Detroit http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-39386 Sat, 08 Nov 2008 23:43:15 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-39386 Those points you made are a concern of mine too. I have friends who lived and stayed in New Orleans bywater region where the flood level varied and they collected in higher ground houses or toughed it out alone; but most helped and there were relief places and centers in the 10 days before the military came through put up by the residents. They even knocked on doors and helped the shut ins, who were afraid of everything after the storms. When the military entered it became caotic, and the fire departments that broke into every house and the pets that were seized? My friends took care of every animal and cats were able to avoid capture and survived just fine. People did things like leave huge amounts of food out before evacuating. But when the animal rescue teams "stolled" the pets, a lot of people missed them. House muckers took valuables while residents were forbidden to re-enter their own neighborhood or held in camp like settings in far away states. And remember the volunteers who couldn't enter New Orleans because they were stopped by authorities? A proper and viable solution would be to set up local non-profit disaster relief organizations that stay and operate locally. I am doing just that, look it up on the websites listed. We are going to operate ongoing, because Detroit is a disaster zone and offer the proper resources that exist but information is currently hard to find. We are spending our time this winter creating the resource database and fundraising to pay for the bus conversion; which we already own; and ofcourse spreading the word that this needs to happen if we are going to affect true change, not leaving out the ever growing population that is impoverished all across the nation. We could use help, please contact me, Thanks, Jean Those points you made are a concern of mine too. I have friends who lived and stayed in New Orleans bywater region where the flood level varied and they collected in higher ground houses or toughed it out alone; but most helped and there were relief places and centers in the 10 days before the military came through put up by the residents. They even knocked on doors and helped the shut ins, who were afraid of everything after the storms. When the military entered it became caotic, and the fire departments that broke into every house and the pets that were seized? My friends took care of every animal and cats were able to avoid capture and survived just fine. People did things like leave huge amounts of food out before evacuating. But when the animal rescue teams “stolled” the pets, a lot of people missed them. House muckers took valuables while residents were forbidden to re-enter their own neighborhood or held in camp like settings in far away states. And remember the volunteers who couldn’t enter New Orleans because they were stopped by authorities?
A proper and viable solution would be to set up local non-profit disaster relief organizations that stay and operate locally.
I am doing just that, look it up on the websites listed. We are going to operate ongoing, because Detroit is a disaster zone and offer the proper resources that exist but information is currently hard to find. We are spending our time this winter creating the resource database and fundraising to pay for the bus conversion; which we already own; and ofcourse spreading the word that this needs to happen if we are going to affect true change, not leaving out the ever growing population that is impoverished all across the nation.
We could use help, please contact me,
Thanks,
Jean

]]> by: Matt Gagnon http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-37011 Tue, 14 Oct 2008 15:54:48 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-37011 This was an interesting post, and some great comments. It is human nature that we don't do enough to prepare for things. We usually don't do something until it's too late. The lessons learned will occasionally make people proactive, but in general, people don't do enough before a disaster, and it hurts us. All we can do is learn from our past. This was an interesting post, and some great comments. It is human nature that we don’t do enough to prepare for things. We usually don’t do something until it’s too late. The lessons learned will occasionally make people proactive, but in general, people don’t do enough before a disaster, and it hurts us. All we can do is learn from our past.

]]> by: Donna Callejon http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-35096 Wed, 17 Sep 2008 19:58:51 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-35096 Interesting conversation going here. At <a href="http://www.globalgiving.com" rel="nofollow">GlobalGiving</a> our emphasis is on "community-led" solutions and organizations (while admittedly some of the projects are run by international NGOs). This worked out well for donors who used our platform in response to the Burma Cyclone and China Earthquake earlier this year. In both cases, we had already established relationships with organizations already authorized and working in these tough locations, and we were able to get funds to the ground very quickly. In the case of China, our project partner, Half the Sky Foundation,<a href="http://www.globalgiving.com/pr/2100/proj2086d.html" rel="nofollow">posted regular updates</a> so that donors were kept aware of how their funds were being used in the short term (and longer term). Highlighting this to say that all "impulsive" disaster giving isn't necessarily a waste. Cheers, Donna @ GG Interesting conversation going here. At
GlobalGiving our emphasis is on “community-led” solutions and organizations (while admittedly some of the projects are run by international NGOs). This worked out well for donors who used our platform in response to the Burma Cyclone and China Earthquake earlier this year. In both cases, we had already established relationships with organizations already authorized and working in these tough locations, and we were able to get funds to the ground very quickly. In the case of China, our project partner, Half the Sky Foundation,posted regular updates so that donors were kept aware of how their funds were being used in the short term (and longer term).

Highlighting this to say that all “impulsive” disaster giving isn’t necessarily a waste.

Cheers,
Donna @ GG

]]> by: Rosemary Cairns http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-34073 Sat, 06 Sep 2008 13:20:47 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2008/08/29/the-case-against-disaster-relief/#comment-34073 You can find some good 'lessons learned' documents on the website of the International Strategy for Disaster Reduction at http://www.unisdr.org/. Part of what you are pointing out is that there aren't enough (or perhaps good enough) links between relief, rehabilitation and development. I haven't read the report you reference as yet, but I do know that much of what happens in development is not locally-driven. Yet the case of the APOC - set up to control river blindness or onchocerciasis - shows that "community-directed" health care delivery can make a huge difference in health care delivery. And in fact, can help strengthen weak health care systems from the bottom up, rather than from the top down, as much of the current work attempts to do. See http://www.who.int/tdr/publications/tdrnews/news80/cdi.htm. Rosemary You can find some good ‘lessons learned’ documents on the website of the International Strategy for Disaster Reduction at http://www.unisdr.org/.

Part of what you are pointing out is that there aren’t enough (or perhaps good enough) links between relief, rehabilitation and development.

I haven’t read the report you reference as yet, but I do know that much of what happens in development is not locally-driven. Yet the case of the APOC - set up to control river blindness or onchocerciasis - shows that “community-directed” health care delivery can make a huge difference in health care delivery. And in fact, can help strengthen weak health care systems from the bottom up, rather than from the top down, as much of the current work attempts to do. See http://www.who.int/tdr/publications/tdrnews/news80/cdi.htm.

Rosemary

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