Comments on: Who needs in-kind donations more: the recipients or the givers? http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/ Exploring how to get real change for your dollar. Thu, 17 May 2012 08:11:01 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.0.7 by: Christian http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-205527 Thu, 07 Apr 2011 17:39:28 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-205527 Dear All, Thanks Holden for sharing all this. I have been working in about 25 different countries about the world. A lot of them were in Africa. I visited several African countries as well. I can tell you, that nothing is more welcome than money. T-Shirts and other gifts will not solve the daily probels of very poor people, and even in Africa, most people can afford cloths, a phone and food. Still, they are very poor, and poverty is everywhere. However, my impression is, that money used for education is the best thing you can do. Education is the key out of poverty. Dear All,

Thanks Holden for sharing all this. I have been working in about 25 different countries about the world. A lot of them were in Africa. I visited several African countries as well. I can tell you, that nothing is more welcome than money. T-Shirts and other gifts will not solve the daily probels of very poor people, and even in Africa, most people can afford cloths, a phone and food. Still, they are very poor, and poverty is everywhere. However, my impression is, that money used for education is the best thing you can do. Education is the key out of poverty.

]]> by: Holden http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-128017 Wed, 05 May 2010 20:17:10 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-128017 <strong>Joe</strong>, what you are describing sounds something like the "Goodwill" model. I agree with you that it seems superior (for most cases) to simply handing out donated goods; my critique was directed specifically at the latter. <strong>Joe and Rob</strong>, you both emphasize the potential undermining of local industry by donated goods. I think this is a very valid concern. The first part of the post was intended as a very general critique of gifts in kind, not a comprehensive list of the ways in which they can be harmful. However, the USAID quote in the second part of the post does give a pretty good list, and includes the concern about undermining local industry. <strong>Mischa</strong>, I agree that gifts in kind can be a good thing when they originate with a specific local need. The second bullet point in my footnote was intended to include such a situation. Joe, what you are describing sounds something like the “Goodwill” model. I agree with you that it seems superior (for most cases) to simply handing out donated goods; my critique was directed specifically at the latter.

Joe and Rob, you both emphasize the potential undermining of local industry by donated goods. I think this is a very valid concern. The first part of the post was intended as a very general critique of gifts in kind, not a comprehensive list of the ways in which they can be harmful. However, the USAID quote in the second part of the post does give a pretty good list, and includes the concern about undermining local industry.

Mischa, I agree that gifts in kind can be a good thing when they originate with a specific local need. The second bullet point in my footnote was intended to include such a situation.

]]> by: Amy Sterling Casil http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-127394 Mon, 03 May 2010 21:10:16 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-127394 This is from the perspective of international aid, and even though I do not work in that type of nonprofit, I think there is a really big disconnect between what people in the US view as "a good thing to donate" and what is actually needed. Most depressing of all, I have experienced for years the type of "giving" programs encouraged by many local religious organizations, clubs and schools. Some people think it's fine to box up trash and send it overseas - and it's shocking that nobody suggests, "If it is trash here and not usable, why is it usable in the area where a disaster has occurred?" As has been mentioned, irretrievably soiled clothing, contaminated items, or broken and unusable items - it's like shipping the landfill. Saddest of all are the dirty, broken and useless toys donated to "poor children." Whenever I have spoken to school classes, I've always acknowledged the fact that they care and are thinking of others who could be very far around the world, and who need food, water, and a safe place to live, go to school, cook and sleep. Then I pick out the grungiest, most repulsive dirty toy and ask them how they'd feel if they had one birthday present, and they opened it up, and this was inside. It has worked . . . now, I think we all need to do this type of one-on-one asking people to step back and think. A $1 donation can buy clean water, go toward purification equipment, or buy food or help ship local, fresh food. Have a clue! This is from the perspective of international aid, and even though I do not work in that type of nonprofit, I think there is a really big disconnect between what people in the US view as “a good thing to donate” and what is actually needed. Most depressing of all, I have experienced for years the type of “giving” programs encouraged by many local religious organizations, clubs and schools. Some people think it’s fine to box up trash and send it overseas - and it’s shocking that nobody suggests, “If it is trash here and not usable, why is it usable in the area where a disaster has occurred?” As has been mentioned, irretrievably soiled clothing, contaminated items, or broken and unusable items - it’s like shipping the landfill. Saddest of all are the dirty, broken and useless toys donated to “poor children.” Whenever I have spoken to school classes, I’ve always acknowledged the fact that they care and are thinking of others who could be very far around the world, and who need food, water, and a safe place to live, go to school, cook and sleep. Then I pick out the grungiest, most repulsive dirty toy and ask them how they’d feel if they had one birthday present, and they opened it up, and this was inside. It has worked . . . now, I think we all need to do this type of one-on-one asking people to step back and think. A $1 donation can buy clean water, go toward purification equipment, or buy food or help ship local, fresh food. Have a clue!

]]> by: Rob http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-127363 Mon, 03 May 2010 17:12:55 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-127363 Joe: That's fine, but what you're describing is a fund-raising business for NGOs, not a development activity. It's akin to all those charities in Britain who used to get volunteers to collect old newspapers, which were then sold as raw material to paper recycling plants. Holden: I think your post doesn't go far enough in opposing the free T-shirts idea. Even if (1) T-shirts could cost-effectively be donated, shipped and distributed in developing countries, and (2) the T-shirts were wanted by potential recipients, that still doesn't make it a good thing to do. It's likely that dumping large numbers of free T-shirts could damage the income of local clothing retailers (as well as manufacturers, if there are any), and so put people out of work. This is mentioned in passing in the above quotation from USAID, but seems to me to be the nub of the issue. This isn't just a theoretical possibility. I am told that Haiti had thriving textile and tailoring industries until large numbers of clothes (known in the country as "Kennedys") were donated by the US government for hurricane relief in the 1960s. Nowadays, basically the only clothes available for sale in the country are used clothes from the US. Joe: That’s fine, but what you’re describing is a fund-raising business for NGOs, not a development activity. It’s akin to all those charities in Britain who used to get volunteers to collect old newspapers, which were then sold as raw material to paper recycling plants.

Holden: I think your post doesn’t go far enough in opposing the free T-shirts idea. Even if (1) T-shirts could cost-effectively be donated, shipped and distributed in developing countries, and (2) the T-shirts were wanted by potential recipients, that still doesn’t make it a good thing to do. It’s likely that dumping large numbers of free T-shirts could damage the income of local clothing retailers (as well as manufacturers, if there are any), and so put people out of work. This is mentioned in passing in the above quotation from USAID, but seems to me to be the nub of the issue.

This isn’t just a theoretical possibility. I am told that Haiti had thriving textile and tailoring industries until large numbers of clothes (known in the country as “Kennedys”) were donated by the US government for hurricane relief in the 1960s. Nowadays, basically the only clothes available for sale in the country are used clothes from the US.

]]> by: Mischa http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-127276 Mon, 03 May 2010 03:47:46 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-127276 While I agree with most of what was written here, I have to put in a plug for targeted in-kind donations, especially in relief situations. The main thing is targeted. If I'm on the ground and I need a specific item in a specific quantity, it's often the perfect donation to just fill my order and send it to me. Saves me money and time and gives you the feeling of having directly contributed to something that was really a need. As for old clothes, I agree. I've personally seen an entire parking lot, covered with used clothes (not baled or sorted) that were simply dumped, by the truckload, onto the parking lot. people rooted through them for a while, but this was post-katrina, and few people were so desperate as to wade through clothes, some of which were filled with excrement or needles. so they got rained on, started molding, and a few weeks got trucked away as trash. that was when i told all my friends back home not to send clothes to disaster zones. While I agree with most of what was written here,
I have to put in a plug for targeted in-kind donations, especially in relief situations. The main thing is targeted. If I’m on the ground and I need a specific item in a specific quantity, it’s often the perfect donation to just fill my order and send it to me.
Saves me money and time and gives you the feeling of having directly contributed to something that was really a need.
As for old clothes, I agree. I’ve personally seen an entire parking lot, covered with used clothes (not baled or sorted) that were simply dumped, by the truckload, onto the parking lot.
people rooted through them for a while, but this was post-katrina, and few people were so desperate as to wade through clothes, some of which were filled with excrement or needles. so they got rained on, started molding, and a few weeks got trucked away as trash. that was when i told all my friends back home not to send clothes to disaster zones.

]]> by: Brendon http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-126882 Sat, 01 May 2010 15:49:29 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-126882 I agree with the discussion of in-kind donations. Many times the items donated to Goodwill are not particularly useful to anyone who uses this service. However, the point of a charitable donation is that you no longer need the item(s), but someone else might. It's all based on potential need, and not actual demand. There are, however, other ways to donate items/money to worthy charities. Specific causes, such as Mercy Corps and Africa Bridge, accept direct in-kind donations of certain items. These are then distributed to people who are in real need and could really use the help. Another way to help these (and more) organizations, without having to do very much, is through the online shopping portal for charity, CafeGive. All someone has to do is visit http://cafegive.com, choose their favorite cause from a list of over 40, and proceed to shop at one of our over 250 merchants such as Best Buy and Target.com. A percentage of every purchase goes toward the chosen charity and the shopper has to nothing extra. It's an easy way to give back to some worthy causes which are doing some real good in the world. Want to feel good about the online shopping you already do? Give CafeGive a try. I agree with the discussion of in-kind donations. Many times the items donated to Goodwill are not particularly useful to anyone who uses this service. However, the point of a charitable donation is that you no longer need the item(s), but someone else might. It’s all based on potential need, and not actual demand.

There are, however, other ways to donate items/money to worthy charities. Specific causes, such as Mercy Corps and Africa Bridge, accept direct in-kind donations of certain items. These are then distributed to people who are in real need and could really use the help.

Another way to help these (and more) organizations, without having to do very much, is through the online shopping portal for charity, CafeGive. All someone has to do is visit http://cafegive.com, choose their favorite cause from a list of over 40, and proceed to shop at one of our over 250 merchants such as Best Buy and Target.com. A percentage of every purchase goes toward the chosen charity and the shopper has to nothing extra. It’s an easy way to give back to some worthy causes which are doing some real good in the world. Want to feel good about the online shopping you already do? Give CafeGive a try.

]]> by: joe http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-126675 Fri, 30 Apr 2010 20:41:18 +0000 http://blog.givewell.org/2010/04/30/who-needs-in-kind-donations-more-the-recipients-or-the-givers/#comment-126675 Yeah, I actually think it is more complicated than that. Sticking with the used clothing thing, in a British context the clothing is collected and exported because there is demand for it. When it is baled here, it becomes a commodity for which local charities recieve a commission per tonne before is sent to distributors in Africa. Bizarrely this may eventually be sold to Africans at a price higher than they originally cost. Such is the ridiculousness of international Fast Fashion. Of course, I'm not sure whether you would actually describe this as 'in-kind' donations, but then maybe the definition depends on why the people are donating. I suspect a strong factor for most people is disposing of their waste clothing as much as the potential benefit to the charity or even people they imagine have no clothing. Does that make it good? No, there is obvious destruction of local manufacturing industries and it is a bit sick to imagine all of western society using Africa as a sink for obsession with fashion. On the other hand, I'd say the SHC market is a better way to distribute clothing than handing it out. Yeah, I actually think it is more complicated than that.

Sticking with the used clothing thing, in a British context the clothing is collected and exported because there is demand for it. When it is baled here, it becomes a commodity for which local charities recieve a commission per tonne before is sent to distributors in Africa.

Bizarrely this may eventually be sold to Africans at a price higher than they originally cost. Such is the ridiculousness of international Fast Fashion.

Of course, I’m not sure whether you would actually describe this as ‘in-kind’ donations, but then maybe the definition depends on why the people are donating. I suspect a strong factor for most people is disposing of their waste clothing as much as the potential benefit to the charity or even people they imagine have no clothing.

Does that make it good? No, there is obvious destruction of local manufacturing industries and it is a bit sick to imagine all of western society using Africa as a sink for obsession with fashion. On the other hand, I’d say the SHC market is a better way to distribute clothing than handing it out.

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